Bacterial Infection (I think)

doc

Member
Country flag
Project Brief
Hi ,

Firstly this is a fantastic place full of information, I found the site when looking for information around setting up a quarantine tank to start being proactive about things but as irony has it I have encountered my first problem unrelated to quarantine while planning out my quarantine system L
I’d like to start by saying , I’m sorry if all of this information turns out to be largely useless but I didn’t want to provide too little information either !
I currently have a 30 Gallon display tank which is housing both fish and coral. I also have a 100.3 Gallon tank that is days away from going live (waiting on parts for a Lid).
About two weeks ago I purchased a Midas Blenny, day one I had no issue as he had just gotten off of a flight and was getting used to his new home. Day two however him and my Royal Gramma decided they really didn’t like sharing a 30 Gallon tank with each other. Surprisingly it’s the Midas that’s the jerk but that’s a different story. They are moving to a bigger tank with more available territory for each to call their own. They have also calmed down a lot in the last week as each have claimed their area of the tank. They seemed to have a few “go’s” at each other early on and each did get a bite in when they cornered themselves in a cave together hiding during a water change. The gramma was bit on the nose which has completely healed without issue and the blenny above one of his fins. Both were not bad bites and all I could see on either was basically a white dot.
However, on Sunday night I noticed that the Midas had some white markings on him. Nothing like ich or velvet but more like what I have seen in the example pictures here of bacterial infection. Which from what I have been reading here possibly started from stress or from the small bite or a mixture of both
I live on the west coast of Australia and Supply issues related to COVID balanced with work has made piecing together the bits to make a hospital tank a little difficult though I do hope to have something up and running tonight which was initially intended for my next fish as a QT but I want to get things sorted with what I have first.
I haven’t been able to get any of the antibiotics listed as recommended here yet and am having trouble sourcing things at the moment.
I have however been able to get Seachem Stressguard and API Melafix.
I’ve been doing some reading on both and both are reported to be reef safe and might be able to help me but I’m trying to work out the best strategy so that I don’t make the issue worse with a knee jerk reaction.
I have the equipment for a basic hospital tank now I’m just waiting on some salt water to mix up for the recommended 24 hour window.
I am after some guidance on what people would recommend my course of action should be
My first plan immediately is to move my Corals into my new tank which at least takes those out of the equation as I understand they can have mixed results with Melafix and Stressguard.
I then planned on adding Melafix and or Stress Guard to the display tank with all of my fish (but at that point it would JUST have fish and live rock). Should I add one over the other ? Is there a benefit to adding both?
  • My thought process here was that it gets the Midas some form of assistance to help his immune system fight the problem while whatever stage 2 is comes into place.
Stage 2 which would be in about a day or at worst two days is to put all of the fish except the Midas Blenny into my new tank (not doing this today simply because I don’t have a lid for it but the courier is set to deliver those parts tomorrow) I also don’t have access to a second set of hands to help me move the live rock until then.
At this point I will have the Midas in my current display with nothing but live sand and some bio media I’d leave behind.
At that point would I be best to leave him alone in there to treat him alone and save him the additional stress of moving to a HT or should I move him to the tank I am setting up tonight which by tomorrow could be ready for him. I guess the only plus side I’d see in my mind to leaving him would be the fact that there is already an established bio filter in the existing tank and it might be less stressful. The downside I guess would be if it limits me on how I can treat the issue.
This is basically where I’m lost though I don’t know which path to go down or if my diagnosis is even correct!
In addition to my potential options above I’d like some clarity or opinions on if I’m even looking at solutions to treat the right thing.
I’m going to try and get some better pics tonight but he’s SUPER camera shy and the only way I can really get pictures is feeding the tank at which point he darts around getting food!

If I was to describe what it looks like I would say it is very similar to the look you get when skin peels from sunburn. It’s like there is a white/translucent layer of his skin flaking away. I can only see the issue under blue lighting. Under natural sun light I can’t notice anything and even under whiter tank lighting it’s less clear. It is similar to this, However, without the cotton like texture and more translucent.
https://humble.fish/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/20328e80_vbattach160250.jpg


I’ve attached the best pictures I have been able to get so far; the issue is to the back left of his pectoral fin. Behavioral wise he seems totally fine, swimming around and guarding his rock, eating great and comes up to the glass when he sees me (unless I have a camera lol), I also don’t think he is SUPER stressed because based on how I got him he tends to lose his gold colour and go more translucent with stripes. His waste is also a normal fish poop colour, no white or paleness to it at all. No damage to his fins, not lethargic and not “gasping” for breath.

I can’t emphasis how much ANY help or advice on what to do would be appreciated I really want to help save this fish because he may be new to me but it’s taken me two years to find one.

If I can provide any additional information or if you have any ideas on what I’m dealing with and a treatment plan I would really appreciate it




20200818_183359.jpg

20200817_225405.jpg
20200817_225406.jpg
20200818_182839.jpg
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
Owe if it helps with any recommendations, I can get my hands on pretty well any seachem or API products fairly easily. Other things I'll kind of need to look into the availability of locally
 

Humblefish

Dr. Fish
Location
Navarre, FL
Country flag
It looks like an infection, possibly as a result of physical damage. These blennies sometimes scrape themselves inside of a rock.

Can you get Seachem Neoplex? I think dosing that in a QT would work best in this situation.

Also, a 30 min MB bath would greatly help as well:
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
Thank you very much for your advice

I'll have to see if I can get Neoplex first thing in the morning , it's not coming up in Google searches in Australia other than some US sites that ship here so my Hope's arent too high but my LFS is a distributor for them here so hopefully if it's obtainable locally they can help. They are odd with antibiotics here, I know I can't get Furan or Kanoplex locally for example. I can possibly get Enrofloxacin from my vet though would that help ?

So confirming your recommendation would be to move the midas blenny to the QT I'm setting up rather than leaving him behind in the old DT after I transfer everyone else tomorrow ?

Would you recomend i lower the temp or salinity once I have it into the QT ? My current DT is a salinity of 1.026 w/ a temp of 76-78 should I mirror that in the QT ir lower it slightly ?

Should I discontinue treating with Melafix ? I haven't dosed the seachem stressguard yet but also have that on hand

Thank you very much in advance for all of your help
 

Humblefish

Dr. Fish
Location
Navarre, FL
Country flag
Enrofloxacin would be great! Dosage range is 2.5 – 5 mg/L daily for 7 days; can be used both in a QT or as a 5 hour bath treatment. The tricky thing about Enrofloxacin is the 2.5 – 5 mg/L dosage range is actually safe for QT use, but the nitrifying bacteria will also take a hit. So, the primary reason to administer the medication as a 5 hr bath is to spare your biofilter.

Yes, I would treat the Midas Blenny in a QT. I don’t think Melafix will help much with this. I would lower SG to 1.019-20 in the QT and the temp to 74-75F. This will reduce the metabolic demands on the fish, decrease the damage from its immune response, and slow the growth rate of the bacteria.
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
Thank you so much for your help , I'm sure I'll have questions in the morning once I know what I can get my hands on 😊 I've managed to get the QT setup with a 1.020 SG and now just leaving it to heat and mix.

Could the toll put onto the bacteria be offset by dosing a bacteria supplement daily ? I may just go for a daily bath but want to weigh up my feasible options. Could I use something like prime to neutralise the ammonia if it gets ontop of the bio filter or am I best avoiding it if using antibiotics ?

Should I do the MB Bath on the way to the QT or at first focus on getting the blenny out of the DT and settled first ? Should I just do one MB Bath ? I think the stuff my lfs has is 1.3%
 

Humblefish

Dr. Fish
Location
Navarre, FL
Country flag
I would do the MB bath en route to QT. You may need to do additional baths, but just one to start for now.

I wouldn’t dose any bacteria supplements while dealing with this problem - no telling what strains of bacteria they actually put in those bottles. You can dose Prime in conjunction with antibiotics to control ammonia if needed. (y)
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
Fantastic thanks , it's 2am so I'm off to bed cause it looks like I have a big day ahead of me lol

Thank you again for all of your help so far I'm sure ill be back tomorrow with more questions 🙈
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
I have spoken to a number of shops locally and my vet , Neoplex and the other Seachem Antibiotic products are not permitted in Australia (boo) and my Vet has recommended me to a vet who can hopefully help with Fish related treatment. I've called but am waiting on a call back, it does look like there will be a whole consultation process to go through before he would be likely to subscribe anything but we will see.

In the meantime while I wait on the vet to call off the shelf wise it looks like my options are
  1. Melafix, Primafix
  2. Seachem Stresscoat
  3. Aquari-Cycline
    1. Contains Tetracycline Hydrocloride
  4. Multi-Cure
    1. Contains Malachite Green , MB and Acriflavine
  5. Tri-Sulfa
    1. Contains Sulfadizne , Sulfadimidine, Sulfamerazine
Would any of the above help in any way if I can't get the antibiotics or if I simply have to wait a day or two ?

I have been able to source the Methlamyne Blue , though atm I'm calling around a few places as the only one who has it in stock I have spoken to so far only has a 1liter bottle and is an hour drive away. LFS's only tend to open late morning here though so trying a few more today before making the drive. My QT is ready now so tonight I planned on transferring him to QT after the MB Bath tonight

Are there any particular steps I should be taking when moving him from the current tank at 1.026 SG to the QT at 1.020 to minimize any shock ? Perhaps Acclimating with a drip while he's in the bath or after the bath for example >
 

Attachments

  • TriSulfa.jpg
    TriSulfa.jpg
    53.4 KB · Views: 11
  • blue-planet-aquaricycline-tabs.jpg
    blue-planet-aquaricycline-tabs.jpg
    62.8 KB · Views: 11
  • blue-planet-multi-cure.jpg
    blue-planet-multi-cure.jpg
    48.6 KB · Views: 11
Last edited:

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
Thank you very much for your help !

I'll pick up the Tri-Sulfa and MB now , it's so disappointing that we are so limited to what we can offer here

I haven't heard back from the "Fish Vet" yet but I'll try a few other places for the Enrofloxacin this afternoon
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
A bit of an unexpected update , the white markings above the pectoral fin have completely shifted to about 2-3cm further down the blennies body and I do mean shifted as in where there were markings before now looks fine and a similar if not identical marking is about 2-3cm closer to his tail.

Behavioral wise he is still his happy self but I have noticed he has started flashing on the sand right on the spot where the marking has moved to which he has not done up until now.

Thusfar, I have not treated him with anything other than the Melafix last night.

Would my action plan remain the same as the above recommendation or does that change things slightly? The intention is to still get the other fish out of the tank tonight and into the new DT and I assume that the recommendation to put him into a QT with a lower salinity and temp remains the same ? But should I continue with the same treatment plan or does this change things up entirely ?

Because I know it's the middle of the night there I'll hold off on any meds or baths just in case they inhibit any alternate remediation plan but any guidance anyone can provide into this change would be greatly appreciated. (I'll be reading in the meantime lol )
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
Completely agree that it would be odd to heal up one place and appear similar in another. Will try to take some pictures under white lighting tomorrow.

I tried tonight earlier but after his relocation to the QT he was NOT a happy fishy he went his angry stripped look and backed himself into the corner of the QT only venturing out a little to explore ( think he's feeling very out of place with no rocks to perch on or against).

I left him to relax for a few hours and now He's gone back to gold now and is eating so seems to have settled. He should let me get some pics hopefully.

Will post back tonight US time 😊
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
I have got some pictures of the Midas in the hospital tank, I did white lighting as requested though at least for me I find it much harder to see the markings under white lighting so I have taken a mixture of white and blue in the hopes it helps. It certainly looks like things are improving but I wonder if this is just the visual aspect of the issue subsiding and whatever the root cause is still very much a problem. Or wondering if by any chance what was showing were abrasions on the skin caused by him rubbing on rock and not from the initial nip. I am going to try to get some better photos with my SLR later as my phone really doesn't like zooming in and giving a crisp picture on a moving fish !


20200820_124949.jpg
20200820_125109.jpg
20200820_124941.jpg
20200820_125104.jpg
 

Humblefish

Dr. Fish
Location
Navarre, FL
Country flag
It looks "infection like" although some of the pics also remind me of Brooklynella. If it is the latter, it's possible his immune system is doing a good job of fighting it off as blennies are not susceptible to Brook & Uronema.

I personally would still treat with Tri-Sulfa for good measure, and if you can find Metronidazole I would dose that as well:
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
Thank you very much for your help I'll start with tri-sulfa as per the instructions on the bottle.

He seems quite active and he's eating like a champ. I'm limiting and being sparing on the food to go easy on the bio filter but he's taking everything he's given. The marking is clearly still there but without question getting better.

I've ordered general cure from the US along with a couple of other things i can't buy here locally but with delivery delays I dont expect stuff inside a month. I placed the order really so I'm more equipped for the future as far as I know I can import non commercial quantities but worst case customs will seize it and let me know.

I have passed on the vet at this point because things seem to be improving so far. The option is there still if things take a turn but he has estimated a lot.

I hope to get the blenny into his final home soon so he can enjoy it like the others are but more than anything I want him to be ok.

Do you think with the tri-sulfa I'd be ok putting some rock into the QT after he's all healed and I'm onto observation so he is a little more comfortable or just keep the QT bare with pvc ?

How long would you recomend I keep him hospitalised once he's showing no signs ?

Will keep the thread updated with progress and any additional questions. I really cant express how grateful I am for the guidance so far 😊
 

Humblefish

Dr. Fish
Location
Navarre, FL
Country flag
Do you think with the tri-sulfa I'd be ok putting some rock into the QT after he's all healed and I'm onto observation so he is a little more comfortable or just keep the QT bare with pvc ?

How long would you recomend I keep him hospitalised once he's showing no signs ?

You can use a little rock with antibiotics. However, I would bleach or even acid wash the rock afterwards just in case some of the medication got absorbed by the rock.

I would observe for at least 2 weeks in non-medicated water after he's 100% clear.
 

doc

Member
Thread starter
Country flag
I wanted to report back and say thank you humble fish

The Blenny is all better, comming up to two weeks post treatment and he's doing fantastic. This week I'll be releasing him back into the display tank. 😊

What this has done for me without question is pushed me in the direction of full proactive quarantine for everything. For fish it was always the plan for my new system but now ill be doing coral and inverts too.

Thank you again 😊
 
Top