Hybrid TTM to treat all parasites!

Humblefish

Dr. Fish
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Why wouldn’t you assume any fish coming from the LFS is a carrier of uronema?
Good point (y)

FWIW; Metronidazole (25mg/gal) is another good medication to clear a fish of brook + uronema, and that can be dosed directly into the QT. The caveat is it needs to be ~ 99% pure Metronidazole powder. Seachem Metroplex (for example) is only 70% active, and you usually have to dose that every 48 hours for 10-14 days to get the job done.
 

bken1313

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I successfully transferred a Yellow Coris Wrass (previously incorrectly identified as a yellow and purple) and two pajama cardinals to the DT on Thanksgiving. None of the fish ever showed any visible sign of internal or external disease. I did a 75 ppm H2O2 dip prior to transfer from Tank 1 to Tank 2. I did a 150 ppm H2O2 dip six days later. Finished out TTM on day 13 and into the DT they went.

I currently have a Yellow Eye Kole Tang (previously incorrectly identified as a 2 Spot Blue Eye Tang) in Tank1 of TTM. He settled in nicely and is eating nori rubber banded to a piece of LR. Its due for 75 ppm H2O2 dip tomorrow. Any issues with Kole tangs and 75 or 150 ppm H2O2 dips? I was considering just drawing down the water level in the main Tank 1 and dosing directly. Im nervous about putting a tang in a small container (6 - 10 cup) for a half hour.

Since I'm in hardcore TTM/Hybrid mode I'm plotting my next purchase and considering a pair or Anthias and/or a Spotted Mandarin. Can both handle 75 and 150 ppm H2O2 dips? Any other notable issue with these fish?

Thanks for you guidance.
Brian
 

bken1313

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Hi Brian - I’ve successfully used both 75 and 150 ppm H2O2 on tangs, anthias and mandarins. No issues.

I would consider using a large glass bowl for the H2O2 baths like you see below:

I’m currently using one similar. How much water are you using?
 

mattzang

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would this work?

day 1: get fish and give 150 ppm hydrogen peroxide dip
put into QT, get copper to 1.75+ for 14 days
feed GC + focus the entire time

done and done? seems like that'd be less work than the TTM part, but guessing the second dip is important? maybe do a 2nd dip on the last day before transferring to a sterile QT?
 

Humblefish

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would this work?

day 1: get fish and give 150 ppm hydrogen peroxide dip
put into QT, get copper to 1.75+ for 14 days
feed GC + focus the entire time

done and done? seems like that'd be less work than the TTM part, but guessing the second dip is important? maybe do a 2nd dip on the last day before transferring to a sterile QT?
That should work. The H2O2 bath knocks off most of the parasites and gives you a better starting point in QT. Copper finishes the job. (y)
 

EddieJ

New member
Hey Humble,

Been using TTM for many years. This hybrid approach looks very promising. Have you actually taken sick fish with verified Velvet and put them through this? I have an order coming in with 6 Pajama Cardinals and a Midas Blenny that I am going to use this hybrid method on. I am just not a fan of putting healthy fish through chemotherapy and thus I have never liked copper as a prophylactic process.

Another question, I see you use a glass bowl as the bath, I take it this is the preferred method vs dosing the QT tank to 150ppm?? Just asking because it seems putting them in a separate container then capturing them a second time to transfer to the 2nd QT tank adds some undue stress on the fish. The way I read your process on the first post is sounds like you dose the tank and then transfer the fish after 30 minutes? Or is it you use a separate bowl for the bath when meds are present in the original QT tank?

Thanks for all your work and research along with sharing the information.

Eddie
 

bken1313

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He's using a separate glass bowl and 2 gallons of water for the bath. I've only completed on round of hybrid on 2 PJ's and a Coris wrasse using Humbles method. It went very well and all 3 handled the baths well including the additional bath transfers. I put a very nervous Yellow Kole through 150 ppm last night and it freaked out every time I approached the bath. I was worried it was going to hurt himself crashing into the side of the bowl so I left him alone and peeked through the doorway every few minutes. I don't have any meds in the QT tank aside from Prime for ammonia control and use outgoing QT water for the bath. If I were to use meds I would use fresh salt water.

In the future, with less nervous fish I will H2O2 bath right from the fish store and then place into the first transfer tank. With the kole, he sat in QT for about a week until he settled down and was eating consistently before starting Hybrid.
 

Humblefish

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@EddieJ I have run some fish with velvet through the 150 ppm H2O2 treatment, but I haven’t tested Hybrid TTM yet.

After I put a pause on my business, I should have more time to do experimentation.

I prefer to use a glass bowl whenever doing the 30 minute H2O2 bath. Dosing it into a bare tank is probably fine (if all pumps are turned off); however the silicone seams make me a little nervous (absorption).
 

clsanchez77

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I have to image the contact surface area of the silicone seal is too small to be of concern. You could, at your own risk of course, cut out the silicone fillets as they are not structural anyway and that what would greatly reduce the silicone in contact to just the thickness of the gap in the glass at each seem. I would not be willing to do that to my tank...in my house, but I would be willing to do it in yours :p
 

mattzang

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i dipped my two fish earlier. i used a 1 gallon glass container (couldn't find anything bigger) aerated for awhile and heated the water. the fish seemed fine in there tbh, but when i transferred them into the QT tank, they both seemed less than pleased. wondering if the temp dropped during the 30 min, my house is only like 68 degrees right now. do you guys just leave the heater in there? i have a small heater on the way so i can just use that for my peroxide dips in the future, but with concern about silicone i'd think the heater would be a no go too
 

ColinT

New member
I think that I will try this method on a Leopard wrasse that I am planning to buy this weekend. Tomorrow I am going to try to source a large glass jar. Just wondering if anyone else has wondered why hydrogen peroxide that is sold plastic bottles is deemed too reactive to use in a plastic bucket? Buckets I have and buckets I can easily store. Not sure about keeping a glass jar from getting broken in my laundry room.
 

bken1313

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I think that I will try this method on a Leopard wrasse that I am planning to buy this weekend. Tomorrow I am going to try to source a large glass jar. Just wondering if anyone else has wondered why hydrogen peroxide that is sold plastic bottles is deemed too reactive to use in a plastic bucket? Buckets I have and buckets I can easily store. Not sure about keeping a glass jar from getting broken in my laundry room.
The concern, in general is that some materials may absorb medications and leach them out at a later time. Many reefers believe this to be the case with silicon seams and copper. Although I have zero experience with copper and therefore no opinion on it. Also, not all “plastic” is rated for hydrogen peroxide and can suffer from chemical degradation at varying concentrations and temperatures. Many polypropylene and pvc are suitable for peroxide, but who really researches the chemical composition of their plastics Tupperware! For small fish I use a glass flower vase that holds about 10 cups. Cheap and big enough. For the tang I’m currently putting through Hybrid I’m using a 2.5 gallon food grade polyethylene container for hydrogen peroxide bath.
 

Tamberav

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I am guessing I can use tap water + prime for my TTM tanks? and just use RODI for the h2o2 bath? That would make this easier.

My angel twitches now and again in its conditioning tank and prazi has not taken care of it. It may be the bacteria processing the prazi too quickly though or maybe some ich in the gills. May use this method and then add to my DT straight after.
 

bken1313

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I am guessing I can use tap water + prime for my TTM tanks? and just use RODI for the h2o2 bath? That would make this easier.

My angel twitches now and again in its conditioning tank and prazi has not taken care of it. It may be the bacteria processing the prazi too quickly though or maybe some ich in the gills. May use this method and then add to my DT straight after.
If it were me, I’d set up a sterile QT with RODI. Go from the current condoning tank to peroxide bath, then to clean QT. I’d complete the full Hybrid method per the instructions in this thread. Keep in mind, this method is still experimental.
 

Tamberav

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If it were me, I’d set up a sterile QT with RODI. Go from the current condoning tank to peroxide bath, then to clean QT. I’d complete the full Hybrid method per the instructions in this thread. Keep in mind, this method is still experimental.
Yes, I just can't think of a reason to use RODI if no medications are added. Tap + conditioner should not be a problem for fish I wouldn't think. We do it with freshwater all the time and a few full tap reefs out there.

I work six 12 hour shifts this week so making RODI would be pretty horrible lol
 
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