Internal Issues

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kyley

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I wouldn't count on anything that you dose into the water to completely eradicate internal pathogens. Anti-parasitics and dewormers in the water do help though, because fish drink a lot of water so the medication passes through the GI tract.

Thanks. Different question... Does MB or Prime reduce oxygen at all? I have noticed my Melanarus Wrasse and longnose Hawkfish skimming the surface of the QT. Not sure what this would mean? Could it be they're trying to get up where they can see better since the water is so blue? I'm about to do the transfer though. Thx,
--Kyle
 

Humblefish

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Thanks. Different question... Does MB or Prime reduce oxygen at all? I have noticed my Melanarus Wrasse and longnose Hawkfish skimming the surface of the QT. Not sure what this would mean? Could it be they're trying to get up where they can see better since the water is so blue? I'm about to do the transfer though. Thx,
--Kyle

Neither should reduce O2 in the water. In fact, MB increases oxygen transport to the cells.
 

Jessican

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Yes, provided you use Seachem Focus to bind the medication to the food. Also remember it can sometimes take 2-3 weeks of daily feeding to fully eradicate intestinal worms.

So it's looking to me like fenbendazole may not be entirely safe when bound to food. It's been about a week and despite running carbon, my softies are not happy! I moved this xenia to a different tank, but I think it might be too late.

AE520A31-BFD7-4BFB-A074-3E4C387E86AE.jpeg


The leathers are all shedding, but I'm sure they're rebound okay. The clowns still have white stringy poop, though, so the leathers are just gonna have to hang in there. Fortunately I don't have anything very valuable in that tank, and only the softies seem to be affected, so I'll just stick it out and hope they bounce back. I definitely wouldn't use it in my main display, though, even bound with focus.
 

Humblefish

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So it's looking to me like fenbendazole may not be entirely safe when bound to food. It's been about a week and despite running carbon, my softies are not happy! I moved this xenia to a different tank, but I think it might be too late.

Interesting; I've never experienced anything like that w/fenbendazole. I used it in my old 150 (pic below) bound with Focus, and as you can see I had many soft corals in there. Could the leathers be releasing toxins as they are shedding??

718
 

Jessican

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Interesting; I've never experienced anything like that w/fenbendazole. I used it in my old 150 (pic below) bound with Focus, and as you can see I had many soft corals in there. Could the leathers be releasing toxins as they are shedding??
Possibly, but I noticed the xenia closed up first before I noticed the leathers shedding, and I'm running carbon. And the shedding didn't start until after I'd been dosing the fenbendazole for a few days. Maybe that's coincidental? Or maybe the focus didn't do a good job of binding the med to the food for some reason? It seemed like a correlation to me, but I could be wrong!
 

Humblefish

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Fenbendazole does not have any adverse effects on biological filtration, but be aware that it is death to many Cnidarians besides hydroids and Aiptasia. Mushrooms and related corals are generally not affected, but expect it to have dire effects on other corals (e.g., sinularias), polyps, gorgonians, and anemones. In general, any Cnidarians with polyps that resemble the stalked family of Hydrozoans are likely to be hit hard by fenbendazole, so don't use this treatment in a reef tank!

Source: https://seahorse.com/faqs/fenbendazole-panacur/

And also this thread has some useful info: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/here-it-is-fenbendazole-use-against-hydroids.214950/
 

Jessican

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I thought I had read somewhere in the past that fenbendazole wasn’t reef safe, and this is probably what I saw. I was hoping that the focus would keep it bound, but I guess not completely! I don’t see any ill effects to anemones so far (there are BTAs and rock flowers in this tank) and the cabbage coral looks unaffected, but the kenya trees, leathers, and especially Xenia aren’t happy. Now that I look closer, the pipe organ is closed up as well. I wonder if I can revive any of them if I move them to the 525 or if it’s too late.
 
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Jessican

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So I’ve been feeding fenbendazole soaked food for two weeks now, and the midnight clowns still have white stringy poop. I’ve tried prazi in the past with no success either. The Xenia from that tank croaked, and the leathers are starting to disintegrate, so I really don’t want to keep feeding the fenbendazole food for much longer... Would metro-soaked food be a good next step?
 

drstardust

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Would it be fair to say that internal flagellates are more concerning than intestinal worms? I ask because I have had a heck of a time getting fish to eat food laced with GC. I've tried all sorts of additives: garlic, Selcon, Seachem's Entice, and fish still hate it.
I've had better luck with just metro in food. Maybe the prazi in GC is just too gross. In any case, was thinking of prioritizing getting the metro into the fish if the flagellates are more pathogenic, and they seem to eat metro food more readily.
 

Humblefish

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Would it be fair to say that internal flagellates are more concerning than intestinal worms? I ask because I have had a heck of a time getting fish to eat food laced with GC. I've tried all sorts of additives: garlic, Selcon, Seachem's Entice, and fish still hate it.
I've had better luck with just metro in food. Maybe the prazi in GC is just too gross. In any case, was thinking of prioritizing getting the metro into the fish if the flagellates are more pathogenic, and they seem to eat metro food more readily.

Yes, internal flagellates are typically far more virulent than most intestinal worms. Food soaking metro first, fenbendazole second, might work better for you.
 

Jessican

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Yes, internal flagellates are typically far more virulent than most intestinal worms. Food soaking metro first, fenbendazole second, might work better for you.
Careful with the fenbendazole if they’re not in a QT tank. I lost three leathers, two Kenya trees, and a pulsing Xenia frag in the tank I was feeding the fenbendazole food in. I haven’t seen any harm to corals from the metro-laced food though.
 

Humblefish

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Careful with the fenbendazole if they’re not in a QT tank. I lost three leathers, two Kenya trees, and a pulsing Xenia frag in the tank I was feeding the fenbendazole food in. I haven’t seen any harm to corals from the metro-laced food though.

Good catch! Forgot about that.
 

kass03

New member
Hi Humblefish, I've been following this thread.
I have a small designer clownfish that I got in January. He was doing fine was settled in and eating until about 3 weeks ago. He started swimming at the top of the tank all around my 180G. I see no marks or anything unusual on him. I then put him in a hospital tank. First I treated him with Neomycin in the water for 7 days and used metro soaked in the food for a few days. Then I got some API general cure and focus and food soaked that. I made your recipe.
He wasn't eating real good but would eat a little bit each day. After a week there was little change so I switched to triple sulfa in the water for 8 days along with your recipe plus frozen mysis and LRS frozen and sometimes flakes. He started eating somewhat but 1 day he would eat pretty good and the next maybe 1 or 2 pieces. I did the food soak for about 19 days
In the beginning he did have white poop (was also thin and not eating much) but then it turned to brown when he ate better but then back to white on some days.
He seemed to be doing better although not eating as much as usual but eating so today I put him back in my 180 and he's swimming all at the top again and didn't eat.
Being he's tank raised would he even have internal parasites? Now I'm thinking maybe it's constipation but I did put a little epson salt in the food recipe. I've had saltwater fish for over 40 years and just don't know what's wrong with him.
I do wonder if maybe there's something wrong with his gills they arent real flat to his head like my other clown but I'm not sure if they look abnormal.
I'm wondering what I should try next? I didn't put epsom salt in the water so maybe I should pull him again and start over.
I have neomycin, metro, API general cure, focus and triple sulpha.

Ok I put him back in the hospital tank and added some epsom salt. What next?

Thanks
 
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Humblefish

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@kass03 Tank raised clowns often have tapeworms IME. I think they pick them up at the wholesalers and/or LFS where they are mixed in with wild caught fish.

Sometimes GC works for clearing these, but other times I've had to resort to food soaking fenbendazole: https://humble.fish/fenbendazole/
 

kass03

New member
I took some video to show you his gills especially his left side. Now when I look at the video not sure if it's bacterial cuz his fins look kinda tattered. I know my other clown bit his tail when he was zooming around the tank.
 

Humblefish

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@kass03 I think he has multiple issues (including a bacterial infection). I prefer to use Metroplex + Kanaplex on clownfish for these type of problems.

Are you still seeing stringy white poop?
 

kass03

New member
Some days he poops white and some brown. I found some spectrogram what about that?
You helped me with a different frozen mocha frostbite clown a yr or so ago that got bit by my other clown and I was trying to tube feed her but she ended up dying. That's what I have some of the meds from. The others aren't expired but not sure on the spectrogram cuz it doesn't say.
This one usually barely eats but he does eat a little bit each day. Some days more than others.
 
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